Or Gold.

All, except gina. She's the only one I see with no complexity. She seemed ok for a while, then she went completely insane and went on 'the dark path' showing no sings of repentance or of redeeming. She's super-linear: making everyone unhappy just so she can be happy because everyone's misfortune is her fortune. That's all there is to her.

We'll see more about Reginas and Mr.Golds/Rumples past soon. DONT JUDGE HER YET! :-) Princess-Yvonne. And THAT'S why I think she's Alice because she's: insane, has the 'Queen Of Hearts' as her mother(big possibility) , Jefferson the Mad Hatter is a relative (maby). She also has 'weird dreams/nightmares.' WHO KNOWS yet lol! OUAT is SOOO Un-predictable!

I don't see how she isn't complex, but I guess complexity is all a matter of opinion.

I talk about what I know, not about what I imagine or about what I suppose could happen. And no offense: by now we know gina is a murderer and a selfish person. No offense, please. It's a fact, not a personal judgement.

Don't worry I'm not offended, she did kill someone. I just see complexity as a matter of opinion. For instance I'm pretty sure there are fans out there who don't think Gold is complex, which I'd also find hard to understand. In my opinion a flat character is someone like Bella Swan from Twilight; practicably no personality and little character development. A character with a very simple or unexplained background who doesn't really have drive or motivation. Gold and Gina both display two very different and very multi-layered personalities. Both have this hurt and heart-brokenness beneath their hate/vengefulness. They both also have very unique and well planned out an developed backgrounds; Gold shows a conflicted man who was hurt by his mistakes from his past and can't choose between power and love. He was hurt in the past and refused to be walked all over again. Gina displays a somewhat conflicted villain who isn't sure if she regrets what she's done or not. Gina came from an abusive relationship with her mother. Those things lead to character development in both characters, we got to see how each became evil. A not-so-complex villain is usually just shown as evil and never given a background story. And both Gold and Gina have lots of drive and motivation; for Gold it's not not let something like what happened to Bae happen again and to find Bae. Gina's is to take her revenge (maybe it's not the greatest drive but it is one none the less) and to be happy again.

One of the definitions I found on 'complex character goes as the following; Complex charcters is a type of character that is more than one dimensional. He/she chnages attitudes and behaviours to suit situations. Both Gina and Gold tend to change attitudes to fit situations.

Another;Characters that are influenced stongely both by the environment and by genes. A character who shows different sides. Both Gold and Gina have been changed by things that surround them and Gina was changed by her mother (genes). And Both Gina and Gold show conflicted sides when doing something particularly heartless.


As you said, I'm not trying to be offensive or anything, just trying to get my opinion out there.

Oh, yeah. I understand: I'm just trying to present my opinion just as you do.

gina is not complex because she is not good and bad at the same time. there's no battle inside her. she's not conflicted. Plus: she has not evolved in any way. She changed from good to bad and that was all. She's on a linear path, I see no changes in her whatsoever.

Rumpel on the other hand is good and bad at the same time. He is a gentleman to Belle, he loves his son, he helped the villagers by putting end to a war! But he's also impulsive, has a lot of pride and anger etc. He is conflicted. He has changed from the coward to the fierce Dark One, then from the cold-hearted lonely man who refused love to the man who says to the woman he adores: "I love you too" and "I'll protect you" etc. He is not linear! HE IS COMPLEX.

She seemed pretty conflicted when killing her father and Graham. She wouldn't have cried if she didn't care. She felt bad about almost killing Henry. I believe the change from bad to good is a pretty deep and complex change. Plus the series is still continuing so odds are she'll change in some way.

I know, I said Gold was complex. in my opinion he and Gina are the most complex.

Her change from good to bad was not deep and complex at all!! this is a big flaw of the character: she was nice to Snow , saved her life... and then suddenly: "I should have let her die!" that's just so flat. she became evil in an instant and been evil ever since! You can't name ONE single good deed she has done since that moment. She's been pure evilness and egoism.

It was an internal struggle, after she found out about how Cora planned that horse-gone-wild thing it occurred to her that she regretted saving Snow (who ultimately and unwittingly got Gina's boyfriend killed). She drove all the way to Henry's school and bought him his lunch instead of letting him go hungry that day.

and that's a good deed?! it's something normal, natural... I'll tell you what would have been a good deed: caring about Henry's feelings!

gina is obsessed with henry. that's my opinion. she does not love him, but she's scared she'll be all alone. she keeps him tied to her against his will, against his happiness so that she does not remain all alone.

It's really creepy she gave the poor kid the name Henry as in her late father, as in the father she killed, as in the only one she allowed by her side... I believe a really creepy substitution took place in her mind: she's obsessed to keep Henry and to prove that she 'loves' him so that she can see herself less of a monster.

She showed care when she gave him his book back in both the deleted scene. Because she realized age was 'too harsh in taking it'.


Isn't obsession just a fanatical way of expressing love?

I could actually see that happening.

Obsession is selfish, love is selfless. It just proves my point: gina is linear, she is dominated by only two characteristics ----> evilness & egoism.

I obsess over a lot of things, am I selfish?

She has more characteristics such as sadness and heart-brokeness. And prior to her evil queen get up, love and happiness.

I'm talking about obsession on a human being, not on things. and please don't turn this into a personal thing. we are not talking about ourselves, we're talking about this fictional character. I actually like you, but strongly dislike gina. so, please, let's not make it personal..

Sadness is not a characteristic of one's personality, it's a feeling. she's sad because of her selfishness. If she would not be selfish, for instance if she would have agreed to have a normal relationship with Henry's natural mother ---> she wouldn't have ended up crying all alone in Henry's room.

And as I've said she went very quickly from good to bad. Good and bad do not coexist in her. That's what makes her linear and not complex. We can talk of a good gina prior Daniel's death, and of bad gina afterwards ----> but not of a complex, good&bad gina.

so, again: my point is proven.

I didn't mean to make it sound personal, just trying to give examples.

In terms of personality traits; she's manipulative, cunning, smart, and country to popular belief not so selfish when it comes to Henry. As Cora did to her Gina is doing what she thinks is best for Henry and it hurts her when it doesn't work.

I think she has good in her. Everyone had both bad and good in them.


I think this is just another agree to disagree.

yep.

I maintain my belief that Henry is just an object of her selfish needs and I have very strong reasons to believe so. An example: she used Henry as a bate to make Charming stay with her for dinner (remember that fake letter from Henry she read to impress Charming). No loving mother would ever use her child to get laid.


Being manipulative and cunning are just secondary traits of her evilness. As for being smart... that's debateble. she's using all her intelligence to do evil -> again evilness. Her personality is made of this 2 characteristics: selfishness and evilness. All the other traites
are 'working' for this 2 who dominate her without any doubt.

Everyone , but mostly it is Regina and Rumpelstiltskin.

Yvonne: Regina really loves Henry. Like Lana said in many interview, she wanted to keep Regina human.
Zanhar1: Agree with you, Everyone has good and bad side.

(I believe cruelty and compassion can live side by side in one heart, and everyone is capable of anything.)

Regina is very cruel, but still there is compassion in her. Sam case for Rumpelstiltskin.

If there is compassion in gina I have never seen it. I can't think of a single example! As shown in the example I gave above: gina used Henry to get laid. That's enough reason for me to believe she does not truly love him ( maybe she wants to, or think she does etc, but does not really love him).
It's how the character is presented, judging by facts - above intention or interpretation.
I don't think gina is complex at all, but I can understand how some fans may see something in her. But to say that she's the most complex... well.. that's just contrary to the facts.

OK, everyone has a different opinion.

yes, ok. I mean no offense. I always sustain my comments by solid arguments and examples.

Like I said lets agree to disagree before it gets out of hand. Everyone has their own opinions and we respect all of them (I hope lol) ^_^

ok. just to be noticed: I don't judge gina, I don't have a closed mind etc. I just talk about facts and not about what I think might happen in the future or what might have happened. I use examples from the story.

It's okay I understand that. I just have a very different style of debating, I like to pull examples and make predictions.

Off topic: have any of you noticed how glitchy fanpop is being? I had to refresh this page like 10 times to reveal the updated comments. >.>

i know i noticed too, same situation here.

Princess-Yvonne: Have you SEEN the episodes 'Stable Boy' and 'A Land Without Magic?!' Then if you HAVE you might understand Regina a bit more..Yes she's mean, cruel etc...but she's only mean to Emma because she wants Henry back! She loves him to DEATH!! Now he's living with Emma. As her quote is: " Having 'nothing' is worse than ANY curse!" Well...she has NOTHING now and I bet (not certain) that she'll try EVERYTHING she can to get Henry to understand how she TRULY feels about him! I understand how you said she's 'selfish' and 'manipulative' but she has NO GUIDENCE! Now everyone's out trying to KILL her!! I know you may think she 'deserves it...' But I think 'love' will take over in the end!!

^ I totally agree with you. But may I suggest trying to speak more calmly. I don't mean to sound mean, but in the past debates got out of control and there were lots of misunderstandings and I don't think any of us want there to be Gina fans vs Gina hater/dislkers things again.

By the way if you want to use italics to emphasize your points instead of using all caps you can; all you have to do is [ i ] put what you want to say and then [ / i ] Just don't put spaces in between the ['s, your words, and i's. This eliminates the confusion. Using all caps usually indicated that you're yelling even if you only mean to emphasize something.

OK, NOW ALL 4 OF US HAVE TO STOP.

Zanhar1, Zylice and me have a same opinion about Regina, and Yvonne has her own.
Seriosly let's stop. Zanhar1 is right, Oncers shouldn't fight with each other.

When any other Oncer come here and read these comments, the 4 of us will look ridiculous and stupid. xDD

What can I say, I'm a ridiculous person. ;P

Yes. I agree :-) We'll just 'wait and see.' I'm not angry...As Zanhar1 said, I'm just trying to {emphisise} my words by doing CAPS.....so I'm not meaning to {yell}... Everyone as their opinion and we all have to respect that :-) Now...lets get on with it and LOVE this Ouat fanpop page! :-D

Yes agree with you zylice. But if this continues, i suggest to create a forum "Good vs Evil" where we can point out our opinions. LOL