She will be a strong, caring and loving wife and Queen by independant and giving him advice, support and her opinions. Like she did against uncle Aggraive. She will keep Arthur in check and also kick ass at the same time. Don't forget S3 where she was placed on the Roubd Table, she was on the left side of Arthur, which where his heart lies. Remember S3 and S4, he said that he wanted a strong woman that will love him, support him and guide in his decisions.

Ummm, have you meet Gwen?

First of all my answer is NO! We all know Gwen better than that!
But, I couldn't resist so shallow mysewlf picked making out with Arthur!

NO!!!!

Interesting, submissive is synonymous with kissing? Maybe I am not understanding the question. Guinevere actually does not have a submissive bone in her body. She tends to keep her cards close to her chest, but I would venture to say that does not make her submissive in the least.

^Yeah, that's what I was thinking. How does "submissive" equal "more kisses"? I want a strong, intelligent queen who is not afraid to get her hands dirty but is also a loving, passionate wife to her husband.

I love gwen, but the truth she is very submissive when it comes to Arthur. She does everything he tells her to do. End of season 3 when he tells her to stay in the castle while they fight, 4x5 when he dumped her and she took him back immediately, and the last episode when he proposed again and she said yes, immediately without confronting their problems. I think her personality when it comes to Arthur is why many fans don't like her and Arthur love relationship. Sometimes she acts as a doormat.

Warrior Queen!

can we get booth?? of course she'll need to be beside her sometimes stupid husband to (sorry Arthur..not heart feelings) remind him the right things to do. but also in the same times we need to see romance too.

No darling, that is called incredible lack of continuity in writing not submissive as the main story arc in relationships is about the Brothers of Destiny and the love dynamic is tertiary in the overall Merlin arc.

yes, otherwise she would have two peronalities or what? she stood up to arhtur and spoke her mind to him more than once why should that change and she should become submissive when they got closer and espacially now that they are married. rather the opposite she can be less submissive. defnitely bad writing.

I want her to be submissive because I believe in that for wives, and also he is the king. Just my view, tho not a popular one. I liked seeing her fighting beside him in 4x13, but I wouldn't want that too much, as I want to see her most as his best counselor and support. I believe no one can spur a man on to greatness like a good wife. I want to see plenty of kissing, but don't consider that submission. I could write a whole treatise on submission re wives, but wouldn't dare bore you or anger you with that. Something I feel strongly about so.....

Please define SUBMISSIVE in your eyes HQ. Perhaps I am not understanding your perspective and I REALLY want to understand your meaning. I do not believe you mean doormat, as is implicit in what it appears you are saying. Please do explain.

Ohh, hon. This is sooo difficult to explain in this short space, but I'll try to explain what today is a REALLY complicated topic in a few sentences. Like I said in our quick chat a little bit ago, it has to do mostly with answering the question of whether there is a distinct difference in the two genders, and if so what makes one masculine and the other feminine. Maybe some folks don't have strong beliefs that there's much difference, but I do. So when I talk about submission, it has to do with that. And also, I'm talking about within the realm of marriage, not just any male/female situation. And true submission does not mean being a "doormat." Far from it.

For me, implicit to being a real man is the ability to lead. I see a real man, one who is really masculine, is one who can lead and protect his wife and do it with a lot of love and care and be humble doing it. He knows when to listen to her counsel, but in the end somebody has the weight of the responsibility to make the final decisions and he recognizes that it's him and doesn't shy away from that.

Sooo, a wife with a submissive heart knows and recognizes that she's not the leader but her husband is, and if she's got a good husband she trusts him and lets him lead. BUT she doesn't blindly follow like when he's wrong. A lot has to do with how she goes about it, because believe it or not, you can be submissive and still say "no" to your husband. You still tell him where you disagree, etc. etc. but you don't take the bull by the horns and try to take over the leadership in the home--that's his responsibility.

So as an example, Queen Gwen going out on a quest with her husband doesn't make her unsubmissive if she and Arthur agree that she does that. Being submissive has to do with her attitude towards her husband and nothing at all with how much kissing they engage in. It does have to do with how she responds if he feels, after listening to her feelings on the matter, that it's best for their situation that she's not out their fighting with him all the time. If she's submissive, she won't pitch a fit, be pushy with her agenda, and/or go behind his back to do stuff. If she thinks he's wrong, she'll tell him with love, but wait on him to come around when the time is right.

I hope this makes a little more sense. I disagree with my husband quite a bit, lol, but I respect his position in our home and I trust him as the one who in the final analysis has the final say really. But he ALWAYS listens to me and respects what I have to say in any situation and would never go and make decisions and think "I'm the boss so you do what I say." That's not being a man and for me to never voice any opinion and just go along with everything he says because I'm scared to speak up would not be what submission is all about.

So since this pick used the word submission, that's why I picked it because I hope Gwen will have the kind of man who will care about her and protect her, and be the leader. To me, she already has had that kind of man.

LOL, you shouldn't have asked, Stacey. You know how long winded I can be.

^Oh My Goodness, THIS

This is Gwen! Submitting by this definition is by no means weak, this takes true strength! Need I say 405!

I thought as much, HQ. What you have just described is intelligent and is also known as "picking your battles." I thought as much, that is why, I played dumb and asked you to properly define.

KISSES.

Believe it or not, I agree wholeheartedly. Yes, get up off the floor. I rule in business, where I run a 'sausage factor' by virtue of what I do for a living. I co-rule at home, when it suits me lol. The gauntlet comes off there when with my partner. Good men love lauding it in their home and as such, you can work it to suit your needs, as woman - in absolute trust. Works for me.

Just got up off the floor, Stacey, after reading that you agree with me. *Whew*

Thanks, famfan. Appreciate that so much, and yes, Gwen is submissive by this definition. Let's see how she does in S5.